Dr Usman Bugaje is a chieftain of the Arewa Consultative Discussion board (ACF) and a former Nationwide Secretary of the Defunct Motion Congress (AC). On this interview, he speaks on the remark made by the Nationwide Chairman of the All Progressives Congress (APC), Abdullahi Ganduje, that the North ought to wait until 2031 earlier than vying for the presidency, amongst different points, ANAYO EZUGWU writes
What do you make of ACF’s rejection of Ganduje’s remark that the North ought to wait until 2031 to vie for the presidency; is the ability sharing settlement between the North and South off the desk?
I believe it is a very acquainted dialog within the final 25 years. However I believe a lot has modified that such form of dialog is outdated. Sure, politics is about widespread participation. Sure, inclusion is essential. Sure, folks have to make sense or have good causes to have the ability to take part.
However I believe what has occurred within the final 25 years is the truth that now we have tried these sorts of fashions of North and South and the nation is just taking place the drain. So, I believe it’s time to begin a brand new dialog, to begin rethinking how can now we have democracy with growth.
We’re having democracy with all these items of North and South and East and West and no matter you could have, and the nation will not be creating. If something, it’s de-developing. It’s taking place the drain.
All of the indices of growth are taking a nosedive. So, I might quite say whereas, sure, we should acknowledge each a part of this nation and change into inclusive. I believe we might be dropping out on the challenges which are dealing with us if we proceed with all the issues now we have to begin speaking about North and South.
I might quite be a part of a brand new dialog that begins occupied with what crew we require that may repair this nation that’s about to interrupt down, that’s about to be run aground by reckless and irresponsible politicians who’ve held energy within the final 25 years and will not be ashamed of the truth that they haven’t carried out effectively.
They’re nonetheless speaking about ambitions. Everyone has an ambition to be this, an ambition to be that. Individuals are speaking about their flip however what have they carried out with these turns. They’re destroying this nation. We will’t proceed with these sorts of conversations.
Like I stated, now we have to acknowledge everyone, now we have to incorporate everyone, now we have to seek the advice of. However this could not deteriorate to a degree the place we begin taking a look at a turn-by-turn form of presidency or change into fixated with this components of North and South. Some folks would say this tribe has not had its likelihood, in order that they must be given a chance. The query is: These tribes who’ve had their likelihood, what have they carried out? So, is it a tribal matter within the twenty first century?
Why is that this place now as a result of I don’t assume you have been this fervent or the ACF was this fervent, when it was stated to be the flip of the North.?
For me, this isn’t the primary time I began speaking about it. I talked about it from 2019 by means of to 2023. Earlier than then, even from 2015, I’ve persistently stated Muhammadu Buhari’s presidency was a catastrophe. And there are such a lot of different issues that he did by placing too many Northerners within the safety sector for no profit in any respect to the North. I believed Buhari’s expertise is ample proof that this concept of placing any person from one a part of the nation to change into president doesn’t work. It doesn’t make sense as a result of what would you like him to do.
Buhari’s expertise is ample proof that this concept of placing any person from one a part of the nation to change into president doesn’t work
To favour his a part of the nation and abandon others. That is very naive, to say the least. So, the purpose I’m making is that you would be able to obtain inclusion and never on the expense of growth. There isn’t a a part of the nation that has monopoly of competence.
There are competent Nigerians within the South-West, South-East, South-South, North-East, North-West and North Central. Why don’t you decide these competent Nigerians from the completely different elements of the nation to repair and run your nation? Why do you go for people who find themselves barely educated, people who find themselves crooks and individuals who don’t know of the place to take this nation, individuals who can not have interaction the world?
Why do you go for individuals who all they know is primitive consumption and primitive accumulation and really perverse tastes and consumptions, and simply merely operating the nation down. So, that is why I stated inclusion is a really crucial side of governance and you may obtain that and nonetheless obtain growth by bringing in additional competent folks. Some technocrats can repair the vitality sector, the transportation sector in addition to enhance our infrastructure. The few which have come into authorities have been elbowed out.
A few of them have been chased out of presidency as a result of corruption is not going to settle for the form of factor they need to do and I really feel very unhappy about that. Many Nigerians throughout board stood as much as the navy in the course of the time of Normal Sani Abacha. We fought for democracy however this isn’t the form of democracy we fought for. We would like a democracy that takes cognizance of competence, acknowledges information within the twenty first century as the best capital and tries to mobilize the folks.
Nigeria has a variety of competent folks. Why can’t we deliver them into governance? Why don’t they lead the method? Why do we’d like some politicians who don’t perceive the world within the twenty first century, and who don’t have any document of doing something competent wherever? And all their life is a lifetime of sleaze and corruption. And since they’ve gathered cash by means of these corrupt practices, then they purchase everyone off. Now, now we have a Nationwide Meeting that’s actually on the market. I imply, they can’t stand as much as the president on something.
So, that is the purpose. I believe now we have to vary the dialog as a result of we’d like a brand new narrative and now we have to be continually conscious. And I hold repeating this proven fact that in 2030, simply one other 5 years from now, we’re going to be 300 million. Already, now we have greater than 33 million folks on the verge of hunger. These are United Nations our bodies which are quoting these figures. Now we have a deficit in grains alone. For final 12 months, greater than 30 million metric tons, now we have 20 million kids out of college, the very best all over the world. Now we have all these horrible statistics which we’re not addressing.
These politicians will not be discussing these issues. They’re discussing ambitions, their flip, and who would be the subsequent president, now we have to do a coalition to chase President Bola Tinubu out, similar to we did with President Goodluck Jonathan.
In case you are saying that it’s time to dispose of the system of zoning, then finally every little thing might be tipped within the favour of the North. So, how do you steadiness it out?
The structure is already doing that as a result of the Home of Representatives is predicated on inhabitants. I believe the presidential ticket shouldn’t be clouded by this North and South factor. I believe now we have to prioritize information, competence, braveness and character. An important factor is the character. Actually, for me, sure, the North by way of measurement is 78 per cent of the scale of the nation.
The entire of the states of the North, you possibly can put them in Niger, they’ll nonetheless have one other house for the entire of the scale of the north, though there might be land remaining.
Sure, that’s it. That is geography; there’s nothing we are able to do about that. However the level I’m making is that we should not lose sight of the truth that this nation is sinking. And if we proceed with that form of North and South factor, then we lose sight of the truth that this nation can not develop. So, I believe we have to change the dialog.
If it was a northerner that was president, would you be speaking this manner as a result of in 2019, ACF declared that they might solely assist candidates from the Northern Area for the presidency?
If you would like the ACF’s place, then you need to get the spokesman of the ACF to reply that query. I, as Usman Bugaje, haven’t made that assertion however I’ve made it very clear that whereas inclusion is essential, I don’t insist {that a} president should come from a specific a part of the nation. We must always ensure that we prioritize competence, we prioritize character, we prioritize the braveness to do the fitting factor.
If it was a northerner that was president, would you be saying all of this?
I don’t know when you have adopted what I’ve been saying. In the course of the time of Buhari, I used to be on the forefront of criticizing the best way he was ruling, and in 2019, I didn’t assist him. In 2023, I didn’t even assist the APC. I made it very clear. So, the purpose I’m making is that, sure, there are individuals who say the form of issues you might be saying, however I’m not certainly one of them. I’ve my view. I’ve my understanding. I’m a northerner and I look after the North and I really feel each a part of this nation must be developed in any other case we can not have peace.
It’s important to go international and very effectively that a variety of international establishments are attempting to scale back inequality all over the world as a result of no matter occurs to at least one a part of the world goes to have an effect on the opposite a part of the world.
The globe has change into a village. So, allow us to not proceed with this dialog of North and South. Allow us to change the dialog and begin a brand new dialog about how we get competent folks with character and braveness to run this nation.
Is it that you’ll now assist Atiku Abubakar, and do you imagine he can get the job carried out with all these traits and traits?
In 2019 and 2023, I supported Atiku Abubakar as a result of amongst all of the candidates that got here out, he was the one which I believed was going to do it. That’s my very own selection and everyone has his selection. I’m not an Atiku man. I’m not anyone’s man. After I was in Motion Congress of Nigeria (ACN), Atiku left and I remained. If I used to be his man, I might have left with him. So, I’m my individual and I don’t imagine in being anyone’s man. I imagine that folks ought to have the braveness of their convictions. Due to this fact, I’m not going to be anyone’s man.
If Atiku runs once more in 2027, will you assist him?
No. In honest to what I’ve been saying, when you have been listening, is that this concept of supporting one candidate with no matter mixture of balancing of the ticket to enter the villa to lock the gates after which the spouse would change into the Queen Elizabeth and the kids change into some princes and princesses of Saudi Arabia and begin behaving the best way they like, that is outdated.
What is going to work for this nation is folks of character, folks of competence, folks with the braveness to do the fitting factor. There are numerous of them however the political tradition and association is not going to permit them
We should not permit this nation to fall into the arms of this type of folks. I might quite and I’m not speaking about Atiku right here. I’m speaking about all of them, I might quite we do a collegiate management the place we get the perfect and the brightest and there are a variety of them on this nation to return ahead and salvage their nation.
That’s my view and I’ve expressed this view brazenly in so many locations. I’m not going to assist somebody as a result of he has been an previous politician who has been round for a while after which a mixture of them. I’m not. I’ve made this level very clear.
In line with the publicity secretary of ACF, Nigerians have been offered an anti-corruption dummy in 2015 and from what I can hear from you, in the event you assess the APC authorities, what are among the classes that we are able to be taught from the place you are feeling like they haven’t carried out very effectively as a authorities?
Nicely, my view concerning the APC authorities may be very well-known. I’ve made it very clear. I’ve put it in writing. It has appeared. And if you need the view of the ACF, they’ve a spokesman, who can converse for them and possibly defend no matter they are saying.
However for me, the APC authorities from Buhari up to now is a catastrophe for this nation. I’m not saying the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) goes to do any higher. In reality, in the meanwhile, and I’ve stated this a number of occasions, the APC, PDP, All Progressives Grand Alliance (APGA) and Labour Party, I don’t belief any of those political events as they stand in the meanwhile.
What I believe will work for Nigeria is, as I stated, a collegiate management manufactured from the perfect and the brightest. Should you bear in mind, we launched a platform referred to as Rescue Nigeria Mission. Ituah Ighodalo was a part of it, Pat Utomi was a part of it, Attahiru Jega and a number of other different folks have been additionally a part of it. What we have been making an attempt to do then, and now we have not given up, is to get among the finest and the brightest individuals who can actually repair the issues of this nation, not politicians who’re simply out to earn money and who don’t even perceive the terrain.
They’re oblivious to what’s taking place all over the world as a result of they don’t learn books. They don’t have interaction in debates. They don’t share data all over the world and they’re fixated. The one factor they do is to distribute rice to poor and abnormal Nigerians who don’t know what is going on.
Former Governor Nasir El Rufai lately stated he thinks President Tinubu will get ex-President Jonathan’s therapy. Why do you assume these two presidents of Southern extraction are those who’re being perceived or predicted to solely do one time period, and what do you assume are the decisive elements in that?
I believe it’s worthwhile to get again to the time pf Jonathan and attempt to see the form of place I’ve held. So far as I can bear in mind, I’ve been constant on this matter. Should you can not carry out, you permit. What’s the efficiency of the funds of 2024 for this specific president? My determine is that the funds efficiency was solely 22 per cent.
Do you assume this type of folks must be allowed to proceed? Overlook about that he’s from the South or the North or from wherever. For me, wherever he comes from, if he can not carry out, he ought to depart.
Easy! I’m from the North; even those that tried it, they’ve now seen by means of that this doesn’t work. What is going to work for this nation is folks of character, folks of competence, folks with the braveness to do the fitting factor.
There are numerous of them however the political tradition and the political association is not going to permit them. And also you don’t look forward to issues to occur as a result of the politicians is not going to permit that. Now we have to wrestle to search out our means, discover a platform, mobilize the nation. This incumbency that you simply’re speaking about, take a look at what occurred in Senegal.
Should you had not supported Atiku within the final election, who would you could have supported subsequent?
Actually, I didn’t know Peter Obi sufficient to assist him. I’ve been on this enterprise for 25 years and I noticed there are methods you measure folks. So, the folks I noticed round him will not be people who find themselves able to take the nation collectively.
They have been all reacting or offended a few specific a part of the nation they usually have been all fuming and making an attempt to go on a vengeance. In order that was my fear.
I might have supported Prince Adewale Adebayo of the Social Democratic Party (SDP). He comes throughout to me as any person who understands the terrain and this nation. I don’t have a full background of what he has been and this, however as an individual, he comes throughout as any person who is aware of what he desires to do.
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